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    OL Exclusive: Ron Paul Explains Himself to our cameras (+)


    By chetly, Section News
    Posted on Wed Oct 10, 2007 at 01:17:52 AM EST

    Cross-posted at OutsideLansing.com.

    We're not sure whether any other media in the "spin room" were able to ask the right follow-up question, but one of the hot points of tonight's debate was Ron Paul's stunning statement that he would NOT support the Republican nominee unless that person opposed the war.  That was the talk of conservative's, including Saul Anuzis', who soundly condemned the statement and said "Ron Paul should explain himself" on that answer.

    So, minutes later we found Ron Paul himself, and in conjunction with The Oakland Right, an Oakland County cable access show operated by Jim Thienel of the North Oakland Republican Club, we asked Ron Paul to explain what he meant by that answer.

    It was clear, he said he couldn't support a Republican candidate willing to violate the Constitution on the issue of the the war or other uses of military force, referring back to his answer on consulting with Congress first before taking military action.  The key here was the follow-up question - would you support the Democratic nominee?  Here, Ron Paul will give some comfort to Republicans concerned about his initial answer.  He laughed and quickly said no, as if that was completely out of the question.

    OL predicts that Ron Paul is likely to either support a third-party candidate or become a third-party candidate, based on this exchange.  Sometime tomorrow we hope to have You Tube video of the interview online.

    < GOP Debate in Dearborn: Live Blogging | OL Exlusive Opinion: Service Sales Tax is Unconstitutional under Michigan Constitution >
    Display: Sort:
    After watching Chris Matthews, I know he d/n ask (none / 0) (#1)
    by chetly on Wed Oct 10, 2007 at 06:02:21 AM EST
    Watching the replays of Hardball from the spin room in Dearborn after I returned home, I saw Matthews interview of Ron Paul.  After saying overtly he agreed with him on the war, he softballed Paul all the way, although in the roundtable after several interviews, the analysts all concluded that Paul and Tancredo were likely "in it till the convention" based on their statement they wouldn't endorse.  Take that a bit farther though when you know Paul won't endorse a Democrat based on my questions to him.  That means he's likely to go it alone or endorse an L. (which, I think is less likely, given Paul now has the loyal following).

    Tancredo's less of a concern since he doesn't have the following, although his quiet supporters might just stay home.


    Chetly Zarko
    Outside Lansing & Oakland Politics

    explain what? (none / 0) (#2)
    by prattleon on Wed Oct 10, 2007 at 02:23:36 PM EST
    That was the talk of conservative's, including Saul Anuzis', who soundly condemned the statement and said "Ron Paul should explain himself" on that answer.
     

    what is there to explain?  unlike all the other candidates -- and most partisan politicians -- ron paul has principles and integrity.  why should he support anyone who doesn't represent his principles, simply because they have a little (R) next to their name.  

    why is this so difficult for people to grasp.  are people really that unprincipled?   that concerns me.  i really wish people would start thinking for themselves instead of looking for the (D) or (R).  

    RP and the neo-cons (none / 0) (#6)
    by dogster on Wed Oct 10, 2007 at 04:58:57 PM EST
    Ron Paul is the only traditional Republican in the race.  McCain, Giuliani,Thompson and Romney are 'neo-cons' which is what  used to be  called eastern elite Rockefellers. They don't belong in the Republican party and they have no reason to expect Ron Paul to support them. Their kind sure didn't support Goldwater.

    • Reagan by Ed Burley, 10/10/2007 05:11:45 PM EST (none / 0)
    Saul? (none / 0) (#7)
    by John Galt on Wed Oct 10, 2007 at 05:08:55 PM EST
    Saul wanted Ru Paul thrown out of the Republican Debates.  Nowhere did he say "thrown out of the party".

    But I welcome being corrected on this point.  Please throw a link my way showing I'm wrong.

    My interview with Saul was last nigh (none / 0) (#9)
    by chetly on Wed Oct 10, 2007 at 05:13:11 PM EST
    Ed, my interview with Saul was last night, and I'm merely reporting the question I asked him (which is a "hard question" knowing about the previous controversy between Saul and Paul) and his response,  and that that moment in the debate was considered a pivotal answer.  

    Saul's comment last night - "that he explain himself" - is a measured comment.  Ron Paul's explanation to me was fairly measured - that it depended on the candidate's proclivity to violate the Constitution, and when I followed up he laughed at the idea of ever endorsing the Democratic nominee.  

    Editorially, I agree with you Saul's actions after the summer debate where he called for excommunication were highly inappropriate.  Again, see my defense of Ron Paul on the other thread here at RM.

    All I did was report the exchange, controversy, and responses here.  Re-read the entry and tell me where I went wrong in the reporting?  Only in the last paragraph do I make a prediction, and nowhere did I editorialize. One comment questions whether the question is even appropriate.  Almost all questions - especially of controversy - are appropriate (there are out-of-bounds exceptions, but this is miles from that).  Judge yourself when I post the YouTube (I'm waiting for the master-footage, since we used a very high quality camera there's some production required).


    Chetly Zarko
    Outside Lansing & Oakland Politics

    Ah, convictions. (none / 0) (#11)
    by John Galt on Wed Oct 10, 2007 at 05:25:37 PM EST
    Wasn't it one of the Ru Paul trolls who said he was bringing so many people to the "Republican Party"?

    I guess he's just bringing "so many people" to a party... and serving Jim Jones Kool-Aid.

    Integrity?  He runs as a Republican, and then cries if he doesn't get the nomination?  Boys don't cry, especially from Texas.  Integrity isn't a single issue voter.  Integrity isn't saying "we can't win" and then in the same breath "the war is illegal".  

    The Democrat Party can have each and every one of you Ru Paul trolls.

    The entire "protest" section last night (none / 0) (#12)
    by Nick on Wed Oct 10, 2007 at 05:28:13 PM EST
    an hour before the event started was filled with Ron Paul supporters in Ron Paul t-shirts... protesting an event in which Ron Paul was participating.  

    I thought that was the most telling moment I've witnessed thus far in the REVOLTution.

    • Is it possible? by dogster, 10/10/2007 05:44:46 PM EST (none / 0)
    • protesting? by prattleon, 10/10/2007 07:23:59 PM EST (none / 0)
    • you forgot... by prattleon, 10/11/2007 08:15:34 AM EST (none / 0)
    No... I went out to hang out with them for a while (none / 0) (#15)
    by Nick on Wed Oct 10, 2007 at 05:47:23 PM EST
    to see what was going on.  It was all piss and vineager and vitriol.  Not nice people.  Honestly, that's the thing almsot all Paul supporters I've encountered (dozens) in person over the last couple months have in common.  They are generally disagreeable people who are very very angry and do NOT want to have a conversation.

    • Yes, I'm angry by Ed Burley, 10/10/2007 06:20:52 PM EST (none / 0)
    • bollucks! by prattleon, 10/10/2007 07:29:16 PM EST (none / 0)
    John Galt (none / 0) (#17)
    by Ed Burley on Wed Oct 10, 2007 at 06:29:29 PM EST
    Does anyone not see the problem here? John Galt (you should be ashamed, you're more like John Rockefeller) says that those of us who support Ron Paul should become Democrats. Now, John is either stupid as NoviDemocrat, OR he is just an butthole. I am leaning toward the second.

    Not a single one of the Paul supporters that I know support big spending; unlike the rest of the Republican Party. Not a single Paul supporter supports higher taxes; while the Republicans whine about them after demanding higher spending. Not a single Paul supporter believes in abortion; unlike McCain, Guiliani, Romney, and maybe Thompson.

    I am a Libertarian. It sounds to me that those of you who support the Republicans who want big government and abortion should join the Democrats. But since John Galt is unable to discuss things in a rational manner, I agree that most of us should abandon the party entirely - after all, you guys are just a bunch of Democrat-wannabes.


    Check out new Ron Paul -MoveOn.org ad (none / 0) (#18)
    by dogster on Wed Oct 10, 2007 at 06:38:33 PM EST
    Dogster's "corrupt operatives" (none / 0) (#26)
    by John Galt on Thu Oct 11, 2007 at 08:37:30 AM EST
    "Just google "council foreign relations giuliani" or whatever"

    Or whatever.  Exactly.  More conspiracy wacko-ness.  At least the person who cited Newt Gingrich as a CFR member was correct.

    Now we're hearing McCain, Romney, Giuliani, and Thompson are members.  Too bad it's not true.  I guess we can ignore Huckabee, even though he might be "my" candidate.

    I also like the touch of class using the word "operatives".  Operatives for whom, may I ask?

    But maybe Ru Paul is right.  Maybe his convictions are so valuable - so right on target (they're not) that it's worth running as an Independent and having Hillary Clinton (whose husband is a CFR member) as President instead.

    Wow, what are my eyes reading here? (none / 0) (#28)
    by John Galt on Thu Oct 11, 2007 at 08:53:01 AM EST
    ron paul is a strict constitutionalist, and therefore considers every politician at the federal bound strictly by that document.  he has continually called each and every candidate out on numerous occasions for abusing the constitution.  

    Interesting opening...

    every single one of them voted to transfer the authority to the president, to wage war.  at first i didn't see this as unconstitutional, and i didn't see that harm in it.  but over the past few years it has become clear why congress and congress alone can declare war and MUST do so before we take aggressive actions.

    EVERY SINGLE ONE?  Rudy has super powers, now?  Mike Huckabee, Governor, can vote to give war powers to the President?  Now who's exceeding constitutional authority?

    Funny, though - I didn't see Ru Paul take this to the Supreme Court to adjudicate.

    romney: consulting your lawyers for war, socialized medicine, etc.  I don't see a principled bone in his body.  

    Yeah, I can't see much when I put my hands over my eyes either.  It's amazing how much I can see when I take my hands off and open my eyelids...

    thompson:  he consulted for a pro-abortion group in the early 90's, his idea of federalism is letting the states decide how to manage their welfare programs..."under the strict direction and supervision of the federal government, of course, which still supplied almost all of the funding for the programs," as thomas dilorenzo points out.  and then some other stuff.

    Yeah, and you're probably still upset we pay income taxes - and the 16th Amendment isn't legitimate... and... sigh "some other stuff."

    huckabee:  i really tried to like this guy.  he seems so nice, and i'm sure he is...i'm sure he's a great family man, and a good all around person, but people find very strange ways to justify their positions and allowing yourself to make compromises on serious issues is the epitome of being unprincipled.  he would gladly use federal power to subsidize farms, alternative energy, and other things.  he does not have any intentions of sticking to the strict limits to which he is bound by the constitution.

    I'm surprised that Ru Paul lasted so long in congress, collecting a paycheck while every single one of his colleagues broke the constitution.  You'd think, in the time he was in Congress (all those plenty of years) he would've been able to form such a concensus to stop the anti-constitutional bills like farm subsidies.

    if they can't respect the law, why support them to have that much power?  

    If a man who's been in such a corrupt system for so many years couldn't change anything - how is he going to change it from the Executive branch?  I'm not impressed nor convinced.

    Piss and vinegar and CFR (none / 0) (#54)
    by Ed Burley on Thu Oct 11, 2007 at 09:27:55 PM EST
    I've never mentioned CFR in any of my posts. Not once.

    Re: the fact that I am NOW a Libertarian. I have stated numerous times that I have been a registered Republican for 30 years. When Saul made his ludicrous demand of removing Dr. Paul from the debates, I knew then that the GOP was going to be a place where I am not welcome, as a small government conservative.

    I've asked for details. Name one Republican that has actually cut spending. Not a reduction in proposed spending, but an actual reduction. Also, name one Republican who has eliminated one single department at the Federal level, or even attempted to.

    You wonder where I get the idea that you are a big spender? Duh! You are backing big spenders. You won't even consider a small government conservative. What else am I supposed to assume from that? Give me ONE single fact about what you believe that proves otherwise. You have done nothing but make asinine statements about "trolls" and demanding that we leave and go to the Democrat Party.

    You are so blind to your own self-righteousness that you act like you are just some innocent little civilian in this battle. How ridiculous! You haven't talked about one substantive issue in the entire time I have been here. You continually just mock and ridicule. Excuse me, but that's what Democrats do...it's not what Republicans are supposed to do. WE discuss the issues. At least, that is, until Saul took over the MIGOP. That's when issues didn't matter, just who got in the debates.

    I have stated categorically what I believe:

    1.bring troops in non-combat areas home.
    2.Stop nation-building.
    3.Monitor Iran, but don't attack until a war is declared and that based on data that shows we are iminently in danger.
    4.Get rid of the Dept. of Education, HE&W, and Social Security to begin with.

    1. Legalize marijuana, not just for medical but also recreational purposes.
    2. Secure the borders, but liberalize immigration for those willing to come here legally.
    7.Work toward real global trade, not Clinton's NAFTA crap, where American manufacturers got tax breaks for moving jobs out of the USA.
    1. Get the Federal Government out of my nutritional business, and out of my medical business.
    2. We need more pro-life justices so that Roe v. Wade is finally and rightly overturned.
    3. Repeal the Patriot Act, or at least those parts that overstep Constitutional authority.

    These are things that I'd like to see the GOP embrace. Even with these, I believe there is room for debate. But your attitude is what is driving people away from the GOP. Your Way or the High Way.

    Fine. I will leave, thanks to people like you. I will guarantee you though, if the GOP doesn't begin addressing what Dr Paul is asking them to consider, this country's life span will be short.

    Vote Libertarian - the only true conservative party left. The GOP doesn't want conservatives, just ask John (Galt) Rockefeller.

    Wow. 50 plus responses & n/ even frontpage (none / 0) (#55)
    by chetly on Fri Oct 12, 2007 at 01:41:52 AM EST
    Wow.  I did not intend and can't believe how much this response this item generated.

    For those that insult Paul people or ask that they go to the Dem. side, that's stupid, and I condemn it as I did 30 responses ago. There are many things to like about Ron Paul, and he's far closer to us than he is the Dems. Reject him and his supporters at your (our) own peril.

    For Paul people, you need to take it less personally.  Politics is rough.  When your candidate makes certain statements you have to be prepared for some ire from his supporters of his opponents.  


    Chetly Zarko
    Outside Lansing & Oakland Politics

    JG - Wake up from denial (none / 0) (#65)
    by dogster on Fri Oct 12, 2007 at 01:17:47 PM EST
    CFR Fred
    OK?
    McCain adressing KKK, er, CFR
    OK?

    And yes, they are under all our beds.

    • Denial? by John Galt, 10/12/2007 01:24:25 PM EST (none / 0)
    If you don't mind, JG (none / 0) (#67)
    by dogster on Fri Oct 12, 2007 at 01:33:27 PM EST
    Since I've proved my statements re Thompson and McCain would you please explain why it is that you don't mind having an elite cabal running the country?

    There seem to be an lot of complacent folks like you, and I'd like to understand what you're thinking about.

    More unfounded accusations (none / 0) (#68)
    by John Galt on Fri Oct 12, 2007 at 02:26:39 PM EST
    Since I've proved my statements re Thompson and McCain would you please explain why it is that you don't mind having an elite cabal running the country?
    There seem to be an lot of complacent folks like you, and I'd like to understand what you're thinking about.

    You haven't proven anything yet.  In fact, you haven't answered who has donated to Ron Paul's campaign and where he's spoken at.  Let alone, does he endorse and adopt the views of every organization he speaks in front of?

    You go further to assert I hold a certain view.  You need to prove I hold that view before I go defending or denying it.  

    I have no reason to play the "have you quit beating your wife?" game with you.  

    Who pays for Ron Paul? (none / 0) (#69)
    by John Galt on Fri Oct 12, 2007 at 02:55:04 PM EST
    Since people keep talking about CFR backing the "other Republican candidates"... I thought I'd see who is backing Old Ron.

    Didn't someone mention Federal Reserve Banks?  Is that why he takes money from Citibank?  Aren't some of these companies in favor of a North American Union?  A cursory search on "Home depot North American Union" brings up a few hits - and reference also UPS, AT&T, and HSBC.

    So for those curious about who pays for Ron Paul - Here you go.

    -----------------------------------
    Contributed to Ron Paul between 1999-2007 (Congressional Campaign Only)

    AFLAC insurance.
    American Hospital Association PAC
    Credit Union Legislative PAC
    National Association of Realtors PAC
    National Community Pharmacists Assoc.
    UPS
    Consumer Electronics Assoc.
    American Medical Association
    Arab American Leadership Council *
    Anheuser Busch
    Deloitte & Touche
    Associated Builders and Contractors PAC
    Home Depot
    National League of Postmasters
    AT&T
    BASF
    Milk Producers PAC
    Manufactured Housing Institute PAC
    Mortgage Insurance Companies of America PAC
    Nabisco
    Phillips
    Spherion
    Walgreens
    Citicorp (didn't someone mention "Federal Reserve" banks?)
    Continental Airlines
    HSBC
    RJ Reynolds
    Union Carbide
    Verizon


    • game, set, match by dogster, 10/12/2007 03:42:01 PM EST (none / 0)
      • Wow... by John Galt, 10/12/2007 03:56:35 PM EST (none / 0)
    North American Union (none / 0) (#72)
    by dogster on Fri Oct 12, 2007 at 04:19:53 PM EST
    Here's a link to a respectable conservative magazine for those of you who believe that conspiracy nonsense.  NAU

    • The same ... by John Galt, 10/12/2007 07:26:00 PM EST (none / 0)
    The War and Ron Paul (none / 0) (#75)
    by Ed Burley on Sat Oct 13, 2007 at 08:42:02 AM EST
    Look, I know I may get slammed even by the Paul supporters, but all along I've tried to say that I am NOT against the war. I am against "nation-building" which always results in setting up some moron worse than the former moron.

    I think most people are, as I am, sick of Bush's "pussy-footin' around" over there. He has never taken an America First position. We are NOT over there protecting our interests the way we should.

    The reason I support Paul are two-fold. 1) fiscal responsibility, and 2) Bush's failed foreign policy.

    1. The other Republicans are neo-cons who believe that government is still the answer to our problems, rather than seeing that they ARE the problem. We need limited, small government; not continued growth of government with the private sector taking over the distribution of funds.

    2. As I said earlier, Bush is pussy-footin' around in the Middle East. Our next President should either pick up the pace and kill the enemy, or get the hell out. The quagmire that we are in is not in anyone's best interest, let alone the U.S. Either we should get out entirely, or start blowing the hell out of our enemies. That's why Bush's ratings are so low.

    Small government is my main concern. It's why I will vote for Paul. It has nothing to do with the war, or CFR, or any other idea. Small government - cutting the budget, change our philosophy back to what the founders intended.


    Personally, I'm not sure (none / 0) (#77)
    by snoopygirlmi on Sun Oct 14, 2007 at 01:15:25 PM EST
    if we can ever get back to the true intent of the founders considering how much more of our budget is devoted to social programs and the creation of the "entitlement" society.

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